Using Your Voice

Anne: Good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Coffee, Tea and Consciousness — I'm Anne.

Mel: I'm Mel. Welcome, thanks for joining. Before I forget — if you like this show and you're enjoying listening to this crazy nonsense, please click a like, and if you're willing, leave some sort of review. It makes us more findable.

Anne: Yeah, love that.

Mel: Nice job. All right, Annie, what do we got for today?

Anne: Okay, so — going into this deeper. I've been working through stuff. I like to share it with my husband, and the majority of what comes up is stuff that happened in the past in our relationship. He takes offense because he feels like he's being attacked, which isn't what I'm going for. I'm trying to explain my feelings. What he did in the past, he did do it, and it did make me feel a certain way — but at the same time, it's not just him. It's also my energy in the equation. It was also about my self-worth, and feeling like I couldn't tell him a thing at the time, so I sucked it down. A lot of it was his traveling for work — I get it, you can't always say when you're going out of town, that's part of the job. But sometimes it would get extended for other reasons, and I should have said something. And I didn't, because I didn't feel like I could. His actions caused me to feel a certain way, or do a certain thing — but it was also my energy that contributed to that thing happening. You know what I mean?

Mel: Yeah. So, to put it concisely — it's not blame exactly, but the experience is happening for the experience to move through something. Your energy is calling in this experience. His energy is calling in this experience. For you, it was never being heard — you're throwing out this energy of "nobody ever listens to me, nobody hears me," which no one can see in real life, and you get that right back. On his side, he's got a running pattern of "I feel attacked, I've gotta run away." I'm sure that's been going on since childhood — he witnessed similar situations with his father. "I'm gonna get attacked, I'm gonna run away." Runaway doesn't have to mean forever — might mean to the golf course, a bike ride. Nothing's wrong with a bike ride. It's not about the bike ride — it's that every time I bring something up, you have another place to go. Even if that energy sends him out of town all the time, so you also never feel heard, and when you try, he gets to run away again. It isn't necessarily his fault. Energy drives the train every single day. Whether we see it or not, energy drives all the trains.

Anne: Right. And that's what I was trying to explain to him this weekend. I'm sure to him it feels like attack, attack, attack. But there was one situation — I've never felt this before — he got upset and it felt like a door just shut on my heart. I needed to get out of the house as fast as possible. Before, I would've said something to try to move him along in the process — that was my fear talking. This time felt different. It had nothing to do with him. It was about me, moving through this energy — for me, not for him. It doesn't get talked about enough. It's easy as a human to see "this person did this to me, what an asshole" — but it's so much deeper and bigger than that. Some of it is karmic stuff you came here to work through in this lifetime.

Mel: It doesn't matter where the energy's coming from — an unfinished past life, or wherever — energy is always driving the train. When you're in it, you can't see it. I was in an energy I can't even name anymore because it doesn't matter — I was in it my whole life until recently: guilt. Everything I felt was guilty, all the time. I didn't notice it for a long time. But in addition to me getting it from everywhere, everyone else was getting my energy too — whatever my export was, whether it was defensiveness, getting in people's faces — they were calling that in too. We aren't here alone. You get it from your animals, your neighbors, everywhere. Jimmy had this experience — he isn't having it anymore, but for years he'd walk around, we'd go for a walk, people wouldn't acknowledge him. He'd stop and say hi to someone, and they'd just look at their phone and keep walking. He'd come home from work: "blah blah blah," and blame it on the phones — everyone's on their phone, it's a phone problem. It has nothing to do with the phones. I walk by somebody and I swear they'll drop their phone to talk to me. It's — normally it's because they need something to be a whatever to. [laughs] I just made that up, that's not even true, I don't know why that happens to me. Anyway.

Anne: What's funny is what you said about guilt — it doesn't always come in the same way. It's a gazillion different situations, and when you get to the root of it, you're like, "well fuck, that is guilt."

Mel: That's all of it. For Jimmy, it was in every way: "You're not listening to me, Mel. You never listen to me." I stopped playing on my phone in the living room when we were together because I'm like, hey, I'm listening. But you can't hear me even when I'm right there acknowledging you, because for you, no one's listening. No one takes your input. His whole life is "no one hears me" — until this last year. I finally got so sick of him telling me that I said, let's take a day and notice every time no one listens to you. Write it down if you need to — I bought him a journal, total waste of money, but that's another episode. Notice all the ways you get that feeling. It won't be a feeling at first — it'll be an experience first. "I remember this event happening, and that's how it made me feel." Sometimes the feeling isn't first because we're not used to tracking our emotions. And underneath anger there's often sadness, some grief — anger's the easiest one to grab, the lowest cherry on the tree. But if you look at your life and notice — everyone walks away when I share my feelings, or I get hushed, or for Jimmy, every time he tries to just say hi, no one acknowledges him — what is it? How far back can you trace it? I want to share a story — I haven't told Annie this on purpose, and it relates. I'll call my friend Susan since I haven't asked if I can use her real name. Spirit brings you experiences every single day, whether we notice or not, and this is where humans have choice.

Anne: And they'll bring it back to you after you think you've already worked through it, to see how you'll react.

Mel: Exactly — I had that with my mom in the mail. So — my friend was considering taking her business to the next level. When we were closing our pizza shop, she was thinking about renting the space. She talked to the building manager, and there was someone else also considering renting the space, or buying our old equipment. She kept saying, "I don't think I should do it — I'm waiting for that guy to say yes first." I thought, what does that even mean? "It feels like I should have it, but it also feels like I need to wait for this guy." She's usually very in touch with herself. Anyway — it didn't work out, that guy didn't rent it, so she didn't take my space either. Just yesterday she came over, and we're laughing about the experience she's having in the space she did end up renting — with a man, let's call him Tony — and how many challenges that's bringing her. Both for her and for her husband, who isn't thrilled about her working relationship with this man. I'm putting dishes away as she's talking, and I stop — wait. I start thinking back to the guy who was going to rent that space. How she kept waiting for him. Turns out he had a very similar name to this Tony. And the energy of the experience she's having now versus what she would've had — she would've been running separate businesses, but also with a man who was going to cause discord with her husband, boundaries she'd need to set either way.

Anne: Is the boundary with the guy running the space with her, or with her husband?

Mel: Both. It's an experience for trust to be built — very specific boundaries on what's mine, what's yours, how we use the space together. So much is happening right now, and it didn't hit either of us until we were talking yesterday that whether she'd taken that space or ended up here, she probably would've had a very similar experience either way — different in personality, but the same kind of challenges. It was mind-blowing once we put it together, how much spirit is bringing you your next step. Are you noticing? And once you notice — sometimes you just have to notice, sometimes you have to actually go through the hard part, set the boundaries, find the feeling underneath. Once you find one thread, you'll find a million ways in your life you're feeling that same thing, just in different costumes.

Anne: It does feel different at the time, when you're not realizing what's happening.

Mel: It feels, in the moment, like it's coming at you. When you're in it.

Anne: But once you recognize it, you can see — oh, this situation is also that, this is also self-worth, this is also not being heard. It's a gazillion things at once. It took me a while — I'm still talking to Tony about it today, and I feel like he gets it, and then he says something and I'm like, "mm, that ain't quite it."

Mel: But you get it. That's all that matters. He'll get it eventually — he'll just keep getting peppered with experiences until he does. Once you get it, you start to recognize — my voice doesn't matter, but now I know I'm worthy enough to be listened to. I keep a journal, noticing my emotions during the month and what ride I'm still on that I can't get off of — and it corrects itself in due course. Even when it feels like a really long ride. Sometimes I look back and think, I haven't thought that in months. That one's completely done. Gone.

Anne: But it's not as triggering, right? Whatever it is. Like — our daughter will say "I don't like that," and he'll say "I don't like that either," and I used to think, what the fuck are you talking about — do you like it or not, or are you just saying that because of her? What do you actually like?

Mel: We like Taylor Swift, we don't — who cares? You don't have to cater to someone just because they say they like something. He did that again this weekend, and it wasn't as bothersome as before.

Anne: What do you think changed in you, energetically, that it didn't trigger you this time? I think it was a lot of squashing my own feelings to fit into somebody else's mold. That's kind of what it was.

Mel: Yeah — because you're not doing that anymore. You're working on it.

Anne: So I was just like, whatever — at some point he'll tell us or he won't.

Mel: I love it when I notice something used to bug me and it doesn't anymore, and I don't even remember the last time it happened. There's a billboard that drives Jimmy crazy every time we drive by — I've never once noticed it. He'll say "did you notice the billboard?" and I have no idea what he's talking about, we already passed it. I've had so much stuff completely taken out of my experience — I can't find things on the internet, I can't find the news, and I'm so thankful for it. When I do find myself searching for something and having a hard time, I think — why would you do that, that's clearly been taken out for a reason, why upset yourself. Spirit's taking it out of my world completely. This reminds me of people talking about new earth, different dimensions — I don't know what any of that means other than, whatever one I'm in, I love it, because I don't have shitty experiences as much anymore. Jimmy was telling me about an experience someone we know is having, giving me the husband's whole physical-reality perspective, and he knows it annoys me — I get that "look" like, "all right, wise one, why don't you give me your perspective, I'm sure you think I'm an idiot." I don't think you're an idiot, I think you're looking at it one-dimensionally. If you're willing, let's look at the energy side — do you know how much had to line up just right for you to have that exact experience? For that exact person to say those two words to you at that exact time to make you feel like a piece of shit? There's so much orchestration in that. Like — I'm walking into a brand new donut shop, and I'd been telling Spirit lately, give me an experience where real Mel gets to come out of her box — I haven't been confrontational in a while, I'm all down for it, but if you put one in front of me, I'll assume it's you, because normally we're all just walking through life not paying attention to each other. So I'm walking in, and there's a husband and wife — he wants to help her up the curb, she won't take his hand, and he's annoyed. They're not old, maybe in their forties. It was like jelly inside a donut watching this play out. My mother would've had a different perspective on this whole gentlemanly thing, raised in the '40s and '50s — and honestly, I'd love it if my husband did that for me too, and he doesn't. But this man really wanted to help her, and she really didn't need it — there was no ice, no rain, nothing. It was so blatant, spirit handing me this exact opportunity to give my wisdom. I don't even remember exactly what I said, but I said something, and the woman looked at me like I was evil. She gave me a look and said, essentially, "this is none of your business." And I thought — you're right. Thanks, Spirit, for reminding me it's not for me to engage just because I can hear it. We get into the donut shop and you could feel that energy — you needed a machete to cut it, it was so thick. I was laughing because I couldn't help it — spirit gave me exactly what I'd been asking for, and then immediately reminded me not to actually use it.

Anne: It's like Tony and me meeting — what a fluke. I was about to leave the bar, and some people we knew came in, went to the bar, and then Jimmy came in with them, and I said I'd write down everyone's drinks, and added ours in too. That was it.

Mel: You know how I met Jimmy? I was dating very specifically — different kinds of people for different reasons, because I was a single mom with no money, and I wanted to date someone with money, someone who traveled. There was this guy — owned a Toyota lot here in Kalamazoo, I don't even remember his name anymore — picked me up in an old convertible, we went to dinner, then to Wayside for drinks. He was maybe fifteen, twenty years older. I used people, no doubt about it — it was fun, and I think they had fun too. This particular night we're sitting at the bar and I think, "your age is showing, motherfucker, I want to go dance." He's like, go on. So I go dance, and there's Jimmy. I never went back to that guy at the bar. Never saw him again. I called my friend the next day: "I met the man I'm going to marry." Took five or six years of dating before we actually got married — I wanted him to be sure, since I had two kids and didn't want him to feel saddled. I actually encouraged him to keep dating other people while we dated, even though it stung sometimes, because I wanted him to be certain. It worked out. All these fish passing in the night — you can't wonder why an experience happens, there's a reason, even if it's just a nice smile at the Y from a stranger. Take every one of those as something.

Anne: But then I get confused — because there's also the idea that just because something shows up doesn't mean it's for you. If it comes more than once, three times, then start paying attention.

Mel: When I say "for you," I mean — it was just a nice feeling. It was for me, but I wasn't learning a lesson from it, like "show up at this exact time every day and this will happen." Some things really are just for the moment — an opportunity to feel good, or an opportunity to feel slighted. It doesn't all have to be some vast, orchestrated kaleidoscope pointing you toward a particular lesson with a particular person. I remember another day waking up and saying, "Spirit, I'm really looking for some confrontation, it's like a drug" — I know, don't go making trouble — and I thought, I've got to deal with insurance stuff today, that'll do it. The guy who got on the line was the nicest man I've ever spoken to. What is happening — I'm egging for a sparring partner and you hand me someone who melts me like butter. He didn't even do what I wanted, but the energy of it was so lovely.

Anne: Did it move you, since you weren't even looking for that when you woke up?

Mel: It shifted my energy completely. I haven't felt that "got me" feeling since. I try really hard not to just spout off — it's so easy, and I've been learning to temper my voice instead of aiming it like a blowtorch at everyone all the time. Learning that it doesn't need to be said right now. Jimmy and I have been in a really good place for a while, but I've noticed a shift over the last few days. Last night at our son's soccer game — he's goalkeeper, pretty good, I can see him going somewhere — and twice he came out of the box too soon, not giving his defenders a chance. First time, fine, even pros do it. Second time, I let out a "what are you doing?" Jimmy and I sit far from other parents because I can't handle the energy if it gets too intense, and because I'm a big mouth with no filter around other people's kids. Jimmy told me to hush. Normally I'd let it slide — this time I bit back a little: "I'm allowed to say that too." I didn't used to let those things sit with me the same way.

Anne: Well — you used to feel like you were embarrassing him.

Mel: Still do, honestly.

Anne: But you used to let that influence you more.

Mel: Yeah. Okay — so I have another one, from Friday night. We get a group together once a month, people who believe in energy and see things differently — we call it the woo-woos. On Thursday I'd done a reading, and something came through me that sounded like a roar — words I didn't know could be true, about someone who's actually very famous. What I knew of her was that she's gentle, kind, loving — that's all I knew, I don't follow much about most people. I called Annie and told her about it, then bought a book about this person just to see if there was any evidence the energy I felt could be even close to accurate. Turns out — absolutely, yes, all of it checked out. I started reading and I was losing my mind. I was upset Annie didn't lose her mind right along with me. Jimmy came to bed while I was still ranting, and just laid there in this corpse pose, eyes closed, waiting for it to be over. I thought, the woo-woo group is going to want to hear this. Normally when I go in, I ask spirit to open a door wide enough that I know it's meant to be shared. This time I didn't wait for that — I just said, "I've got a thing I really want to share," and everyone said okay, go ahead. I started sharing loud, aggressive, and I could feel everyone's energy doing different things. The woman next to me had zero reaction, which surprised me — I expected her to jump on board. The person next to her was clearly thinking, "when is this going to end, when's it my turn." Another friend didn't react the way I expected either. Normally, if I feel that kind of resistance, I button myself back up — this time I didn't. I thought, no, I want to let this out, I want you to understand, and if you're not getting it, I'll just say it louder. But I did notice — for the first time — that it wasn't the same as old Mel just wanting confrontation for its own sake. This was a willingness to feel other people's discomfort and keep going anyway, because I really wanted to share it, not because I needed a fight.

Anne: That brings you a lot of joy.

Mel: My god, so much joy.

Anne: I wonder about that.

Mel: We'll see how it shakes out — but it's different from asking for confrontation. There's something about feeling someone's discomfort for a reason and still saying my piece.

Anne: And what you shared, and what you learned from it — that isn't even confrontational. That's just sharing.

Mel: Right, that's what I'm saying. So I'm wondering what this next thing is. There's a difference between that and, say, the woman wanting to jump in with her own similar story mid-conversation — that's just a human thing, we all do it, build on the similarity. Come on, let's wrap this bitch up. So I can see the difference now — this isn't the same as old Mel not being able to take her turn or stay quiet. This next thing is interesting, because it genuinely excites me: what does spirit want to do with a willingness to feel someone else's discomfort and keep rolling anyway? Maybe it's just something for me to work through. I hope it's not just that.

Anne: I think it'd be more uncomfortable for you not to say the things.

Mel: True — but my curiosity is that I've spent the last year learning not to say things. I'll think, I want to say this so bad, and in my head I'll say, "open the door if it's meant to open, shut it if it's meant to stay shut." Sometimes I'll go to say something and the phone rings, or something interrupts, and it's like — button it up, Mel, that's not for you.

Anne: I'm supposed to be using my voice more too, listening to myself. There was something I felt like I needed to tell Tony — I didn't know if I needed to, but it felt compelling. I'd said one thing already and he got upset, so I left. But I said the rest the next day, and it felt good to say the thing I'd been holding back out of fear of his reaction. It lifted a weight. Sometimes I wonder if that's ego wanting to get a rise out of him — but it wasn't. It was going to nag at me until I said it.

Mel: I spent a lot of years spouting off, and then a long stretch of not saying much of anything — not stirring the waters. I'd get terrible cluster headaches, days in bed on injections. Then spirit took away my insurance coverage for those injections, which didn't feel like a gift at the time, but it was — because I'd been holding back too much. Once I started saying things, the headaches eased.

Anne: I think you're figuring out what needs to be said and what can be left behind. Before, it was everything, then it was nothing — now you're finding the middle.

Mel: Friday was desire, not need — I wanted to share something I found incredible, not something compelling me the way Jimmy's "hey, actually, I'm allowed to say that" moment was.

Anne: Which is funny, because you've been loud your entire life. This isn't new.

Mel: He married me on purpose. Yesterday, at the outlet mall, I wanted a long warm coat, didn't want to spend a hundred bucks, figured I'd come back later. Then at the soccer game they had five-dollar soccer coats, long, almost to my knees — the only downside, a different high school's name on the back, which, whatever, I'll figure out how to deal with that later. So I get the coat, and all the boys are coming off the field, and I'm wearing the other team's coat, doing a full jig, showing off. Jimmy thinks that's fun — that kind of embarrassing he's fine with, because everyone's laughing. But there's a different kind of embarrassing — the "oh god, cover your eyes, she doesn't even know what she's talking about" kind, like when he thought I misread the play and was ridiculing our son. I did think it was a misplay, and it was the second time, and I get to say that. That was me saying, no, you don't get to tell me what I can and can't say anymore. I'm mostly done with that. I don't know what's coming next with this, but I'm excited about it, even if it causes short-term trouble in the marriage. That's fine — it'll get us to the next opportunity, and I love that.

Anne: Tony and I have been through it — a year of working through shit, months of good, then something else comes up.

Mel: I remember telling Jimmy — not saying this right now, just using it as a reference — I loved a raging river. I'd say, "Spirit, let's open the floodgate, let's go off-road." And our lives would flip upside down, rolled sideways with a steamroller. Then I'd have to say, "okay, I can't take any more, slow it down, lazy river please." Jimmy started asking me to give him a heads-up before I told spirit to open the floodgate — he needed to brace. Toward the end he'd say, "Mel, I can't take your raging rivers." And I'd think, this is great, we're crashing into rocks and holding onto scraps of wood. Maybe all that clearing was necessary debris — but it doesn't all have to go like a raging river. Now I want a medium stream. Not a trickle, not a gush — something with a tickle in your belly, not a waterfall out of nowhere. There was a reading once where someone said something about me and emotional highs and lows — "who says we don't like a roller coaster?" Meaning: humans, that's who says we don't like roller coasters when it comes to our emotional states.

Anne: You used to flip a switch fast. Not as much anymore.

Mel: Not at all anymore. It was borderline torture, honestly — high, then crashing. You'd think I was bipolar if it weren't for the fact I'm unmedicated and not that way now. And I want to be clear — we do have mental illness in my family, and I absolutely believe in medication. Please take your medicine. Humans were inspired to create medications to support what people need support on.

Anne: When we had our awakening, I was on Xanax, Vyvanse for ADHD, and something else — Zoloft for a while, then off it. Now I'm on something that doesn't cause brain zaps if I miss a dose. During the awakening I got off the as-needed Xanax and stuck with the other one.

Mel: There's a reason we have medicine, and it doesn't make you unspiritual — I think that's a lie people tell to feel superior. Men and women were inspired to create these things to support our health as we move forward.

Anne: And if you believe it'll help you, it will.

Mel: That's the whole placebo effect — proven, scientifically, that belief alone can work. I'm not here to argue against any of that. For me, personally, the bipolar-looking swings I used to have calmed down without medication — I don't think that's what it was, I think it was just something I was going through that I could pull to a halt when I needed to. I remember being on the porch swing once, sobbing, telling spirit "I can't, you've got to stop" — and hearing, though I didn't recognize it then, "you want to stop here?" And I said yes. And it was like — really? This seems like a dumb place to stop. But you have autonomy over your human self, so you get to win. I only understood that later.

Anne: Let that shit flow, baby.

Mel: At the time I couldn't imagine it getting easier — only more hard. Anyway. Is that good for today?

Anne: I do find it interesting that sadness is one of the harder emotions to get through — the crying, releasing it, is brutal.

Mel: Shame was the hard one for me. I cried a lot in shame. I'm trying to think of where I've felt real sadness — probably with my mom. Shame rocked me the hardest. I spent four or five days deciding I was going to stay in my room until I was done being sad about not having a mom like other people have a mom — my mom is bipolar. I was just grieving. Jimmy would check on me, and I'd say I'm not coming out until I'm done with this, I'm not stuffing it down to deal with later.

Anne: When they brought up my grandma passing in a reading, I didn't really cry — there was such relief, because she was so sick with ALS and so miserable. So I think I didn't fully grieve it at the time. But there was sadness in losing the one person who really believed in me.

Mel: You can be glad and devastated at once. When my dad died of cancer, I was so glad when he finally passed — he was down to a hundred pounds, in so much pain, hung on way longer than he needed to. What a relief for him. But so sad for me — he loved me so much. I was in my thirties, an adult, but losing him then... My dad loved me in the purest way. My mom loves me but with strings attached. My dad — my stepdad, though he was my dad in every real sense; my biological father doesn't speak to me and is still alive — that man just purely loved me, and let me just say, I was a handful, and he loved me anyway. In a hypnosis session once, I saw his eyes in another lifetime. I can be glad his body didn't have to keep suffering, and sad for me, and sad that he doesn't get to see who I am now in the same way — even though I believe he does, just differently. I can express my love for him better now than I could then.

Anne: When my grandma passed — this was a long time ago, before Riley was born, twenty-four or twenty-five years — the light in this one lamp would flicker, nothing wrong with it. "Grandma, okay, I know you're here." Then on the anniversary of her passing, we got mail addressed to her at the old house. You just think, good, another sign I'm here.

Mel: My dad would flicker the hallway light — "that's fun, but now I want to sleep, could you stop." Or mess with the hot tub — it'd just flick off, and I'd ask him to help get it going again, and it would. Now it's basically dead, and he can't seem to fix it from the other side anymore. But it's fun when you know it's him, and it stops right when you tell it to. No scientific evidence of any of it, obviously — but also, it totally is him.

Anne: I believe it.

Mel: Me too — who cares. Even if it's all a big pile of bullshit, it's fun, it's not hurting anybody. It's like getting a nice hug. I think that's good for today. I did a little crying — I know this was a long one, my friends, but I don't know how to stop and start it back up, so you're just getting one big episode. Come back, pause, pick it up later if you need to. Longer than a commute into the city on this one. Good times — we'll see you next time. Hopefully if you enjoyed it, hit the follow, give it a like.

Anne: Yep — it's on YouTube, you can hit a like, give it a thumbs up.

Mel: All right. Till next time.

Anne: All right. Bye.

Mel: See ya, bye now.